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Popularity: 4%

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Jayant Haritsa (IISc Prof) on MS vs Phd

Posted by sundarrajan.g.s as Apping, GRE, coffee with experts, gyaan, jayant haritsa, ms, phd

My last post on MS vs Phd got a lot of responses and varying view points.. So, I thought I would get view points from different people. Today, I have Jayant Haritsa - Professor, SERC and CSA department of Indian Institute of Science, to share his views on MS vs Phd. Thank you very much sir for sparing your time and answering me over email.

Jayant Haritsa’s views on MS Vs Phd.

A couple of random points (caveat: as you will see below, i am heavily biased towards a traditional notion of academics):

1) Firstly, we should not make value judgements between Masters vs PhD in the sense of one being superior or inferior — it is more an issue of what *you* would like to do in the remainder of your technical life.

If you are the type who prefers to work in teams and is keen on developing immediately useable systems, then pursuing a Masters would make good sense. On the other hand, if you are the type who likes to work alone and secretly wishes to pursue an irresponsible life and be paid for it, then doing a PhD may be an attractive proposition.

2) I personally am not in favor of PhD thesis coming out of large systems projects, based on the following reasoning - a PhD should gear you up for carrying out *independent* research and is in a sense, a process of *self*-realization. However, often in a large group project, you get either lifted or pulled down or channeled by the group objectives and members. So you really don’t get to figure out your *own* abilities due to the external modulation. Ideally, a Phd should prepare you for the loneliness of academic life

Further, in large systems projects, sooner or later, getting the software out usually becomes more important than the concepts themselves - but to me the quality of a PhD is defined by the fresh *conceptual* breakthroughs.

3) The reason often given for an industry stint before or during PhD is that you get to grips with “real problems”. My view is again that of the pure mathematician - who cares? The “real” just means that it may have *short-term* applicability, but in practice, most PhD thesis find their way into the real-world in the long-term. To give you a recent example - Mike Stonebraker is now using some of the scheduling ideas from a thesis of fifteen years ago in the Streambase prototype.

Do a Phd when you are at the peak of your mental powers, which is *right now* - don’t bother so much about whether it is “industry-relevant”, as much as “did I have fun thinking about the problem and did I come up with elegant solutions that I am proud to show my mother”.

4) Finally, in my view, ideal Phd is one where *you* come up with the problem, work alone (modulo advisor) and single-handedly write a definitive thesis on the issue.

Hope you enjoyed this episode of Coffee With Experts! Previous episodes of Coffee with Experts is here.

Popularity: 11%

Apping and MS Vs Phd

Posted by sundarrajan.g.s as Apping, GRE, Uncategorized, gyaan, ms, phd

Of late, People have been asking about Apping and MS Vs Phd. I neither have an MS degree nor a Phd degree. But when I wanted to app (long long ago, so long ago), I had got gyaan from one of my senior - Adwait Tumbde. He was CS department topper from NIT Trichy, 2004 batch. He was pursuing his Phd on databases at Wisconsin Madison. He is now on leave and is working at Yahoo! Here is what he had to say about MS Vs Phd.

MS Vs Phd

Refer to Prof. Mor Harchol-Balter’s guide for application to PhD (link:http://www.cs.cmu.edu/education/admissions/doctorate/)

In a nutshell, MS is like furthering your education, learning advanced topics and carrying out more complex projects than at undergrad level. After that, you get job as software engineer in some firm (higher salary than undergrad and better quality of work in US) As a PhD, you can work in a university or in some research lab or as system architect in some firm. From admission point of view(for CS), it’s very difficult to get admission for PhD compared to MS. But aid is almost guaranteed for PhD and almost never available for MS. Some universities like, wisconsin-madison has integrated MS/PhD program. So, its one common pool of applicants and everyone who is admitted is for PhD program and gets aid. He can drop out after MS.

Apping Process

From my experience -

1. GPA and university reputation are most important for admission to any university.

2. Your best chances are in the universities where your seniors have been in past.

3. Have a good resume. Don’t have it more than a page as far as possible. No admission committee member has time to read long resumes. So, longer you write more “boring” you become to him. Achievements in programming contests get special attention(depending on the level of competition)

4. SoP: I doubt if anyone reads it, but make a good statement of yourself. Be objective! No articulate language. One page as far as possible….but 1.5 page is OK. Talk about yourself, your experience in the field and why you want to join graduate school and why join the particular university and briefly mention career plan

5. Reco letters: I know most of you will be required to write your own reco letters….so here are some tips. I believe, after GPA this is most important thing. References based on your industrial work don’t matter. Admission committee wants to know about your skills in academics. If the person can comment on your abilities and skills, then it may be OK.

Reference letter should always focus on specifics: “person took course XYZ with me and secured score of 99.99 out of 100 and was 2nd in class of 100 students. He did so and so work under my supervision. He did this and this in that project. Achieved so and so in that….and that work is up for publication now….in so and so conference. I have supervised students in past who made to graduate schools at MIT, CMU, Stanford and I consider him to be at par with them….I consider him to be in top 100% of students I have supervised….or in top 200% of students who make to places like….. “

This is the reference letter, people are looking for! Focus on specifics….don’t write, “he is hardworking, ambitious….I found him very social….NOOOO!!

No one wants to read that kind of stuff……Include a line about communication skills. It is important.

If you are writing more than a letter… make sure all those styles are different….. people here *DO* recognise that students write own references in India and tend to discount those.

6. Choose universities carefully. Some of you asked for universities and selecting them. It is very difficult for me to comment on choice of universities. I repeat, chances are best where your seniors have been in past. It hardly matters, in my opinion if the university is 30th ranked or 50th for MS. If you are going for lower ranked universities, apply to places where there are jobs like, California or Boston or washington state.

Remember, every university has different priorities and has different procedure and criteria for admission.

First Posted at Coffee With Sundar - http://coffeewithsundar.com

Popularity: 10%

Of MS/PhD Applications and Research Experience

Posted by the Monk as Academic, GRE, Uncategorized

Warning: long post ahead.

This is my first post on this forum, and before I start rambling on about some arbit topic or the other, let me introduce myself, particularly for the benefit (or otherwise) of those who don’t know me/are not from my batch. I’m Varun Ramamohan, Batch of 2007 and according to my degree certificate, a Production engineer. I’m currently working at Oracle Solutions Services India, although I shall be quitting soon to pursue a PhD in Applied Operations Research at Purdue University.

Abhijith has prepared a very useful document for those of our juniors interested in applying to US universities for their specialization, and I figured I would prepare a similar one for those applying for a PhD in IE/OR, as Abhijith’s document seems to target (although it is not mentioned explicitly anywhere) those who have already received an admit and the steps that follow.

Since most NITTians looking to study further opt for either an MBA or an MS, let me explain, as I perceive it, the difference between the exams involved thereof*. First of all, there’s the CAT- a two and a half hour exam, and those 2.5 hours can make or break your dreams of pursuing an MBA in the IIMs. There is no avoiding this first hurdle, and clearing it is, as is obvious, a must. And that’s the basic difference. All your other preparation- the extracurriculars, religious reading of the Economic or Financial Times, can go down the drain if you don’t make the cut-offs in CAT. This is not so in case you’re looking to do an MS/PhD in the US. The GRE is just one part of your profile, and an easily compensated part if you don’t do too well in the profile. I personally think the Graduate Admissions Committee pays attention to your GRE score only if your score is too high or too low- for example, if your score is below 1200 or close to 1600. Even then, it will not make too much of a difference if the other features of your profile compensate or are not too impressive. If your Quantitative ability score is less than 770, though, it might hurt your chances.

What, then, are the other features of your profile? First, and by far the most important, will be your research experience. Suppose you have a 1100 GRE score, a 6-point CGPA, but you have published two papers in your area of specialization in IEEE journals (or even moderately reputed international journals), or have a couple of patents, you can safely go ahead and apply for, say, two universities out of the top ten in your field. On the other hand, replace the 6-point CGPA by an 8/9-point one and the 1100 score by a 1300+ score, I think you can give Caltech, MIT, Stanford, etc a shot. And there’s a fairly decent chance you’ll make it as well, with funding. This, I think, holds true for both an MS and a PhD.

How do you build up research experience? That’s easy: you conduct research. In general, if you are applying for a Masters immediately after you finish your B.Tech, you should have decided on doing an MS by the end of your fourth semester. At the latest, by the end of the fifth semester. It is not necessary that you decide your specialization by then; that can be done by mid-sixth semester. Two research projects are in order now: one during the summer break after your fourth semester, and the other after your six semester. The former can be done in any area that has interested you so far, but the latter should be done in the field you want to specialize in, which may or may not be the same as the field you worked on during your second-year project.

Where do you do these projects? It will be difficult for second years to find a project in one of the IITs/IISc/CSIR-Labs immediately without pulling strings, but it can be done if you meet one of the professors personally and express genuine interest in working with him/her. In case you do not get a project anywhere, try our own college. Find out which professor is doing good work, talk to him/her and, again, express genuine interest in working with him/her. It is unlikely that you will be refused. What do you do after you land a project? Work hard. It doesn’t matter if you don’t get good results immediately; you’re probably not expected to anyway. But if you work hard and show genuine interest, you will most likely be invited to return to the lab next vacation, which you can do if you find the work/field interesting. Perhaps the best thing about working in NITT is that you can continue the work even after the break’s over; also, you may get more time at home precisely because you can work during the semester itself.

The post-third-year project is a very important one. By now, you should have decided on the field you want to specialize in, and look for projects in the same. Again, you can try the IITs and IISc. Of late, most IITs and IISc- at least, IITK and IITM that I know of- have set up summer research fellowships which are awarded to a few students from each department from the NITs. Unfortunately, most of these fellowships are awarded on the basis of only one criterion: your CGPA. But then, IISc itself offers three fellowships- JNCASR, YEFP and IAS-IISc joint fellowship. All details can be found on IISc’s website. These are the best- get one of these, and you can rest assured you will be able to work with people doing good research, and it will add a lot to your resume.

Ideally, the work you do in this project should build upon on what you have done in your previous project. However, it is not easy to do this, especially if you find other subjects you’ve come across in your third year have now caught your interest. In this case, you can start afresh, but keep in mind that the amount of work you can get done in two months will not be much, unless you start preparatory work during the semester itself. One major advantage of having done your project at NITT is that you can easily continue the work done as your post-third-year project provided, of course, your field of interest does not change. Even if it does, you can still start early by approaching and talking to the professor early on in the semester.

If you’re lucky, your work will result in a publication or two, or perhaps a patent if you’re working on an experimental project or you’re developing software. This will boost your chances of making into any university by a huge margin, as this is tangible proof of your being able to conduct research. Keep in mind that the universities evaluate your potential for research from a distance- they haven’t met you, and neither have they spoken to you, so a paper/patent is independent, objective evidence of your potential for research. It is, in general, easier to publish quickly if you’re doing experimental work, or if you’re working in the chemical or biological sciences. It takes a lot more time and work to publish theoretical findings, as validation may involve generation of data previously not available. This is one of the reasons why people working in the biological/chemical sciences generally have more than 100 publications while people working on the theoretical side have less than 50.

Now, for those applying for a PhD immediately for the Fall semester immediately following the summer after you pass out, you will not be able leverage much out of your final year project for research experience. This is a pity, for I believe it can do a great deal for your profile if you do good work in your final year project (FYP). The most you can do in this case is state that you’ve begun work in- this is important- the field you’ll be specializing under so-and-so guide, and that you’ll have close to six months worth of experience by the time you pass out of college. Nothing like it, though, if your FYP is a continuation of the work you have already done. For those who are applying after, say, a year or two of working (like me), your FYP will be your holy cow, and I suggest you milk it for all it is worth (and then perhaps some more).

I think I’ll wind up for now with research experience; I’ll touch upon the rest in my next post. Keep in mind that these fundae are based solely upon my own experience, and please do let me know if I’ve left anything out or if I’m mistaken on some point. Vikhram, Shriram, etc have already done a great job in preparing ROTGAD, but I thought I’d chip in with my two cents.

*I think I can talk a little bit about the CAT in general, as I scored a percentile score of 99.30 this year, and was shortlisted for GD/PI by IIMs I and K. However, I’m not at all qualified to speak about how to prepare for the CAT, as it was an arbit attempt.

(more…)

Popularity: 20%

Coffee With Abhishek Verma - UIUC Phd Admit

Posted by sundarrajan.g.s as GRE, abhishek verma, acads, coffee with experts

This post is originally posted at: coffeewithsundar.com

When I was in my pre final year, I was really trying hard to find out the whole picture of preparing for GRE to getting an admit in US university. However, I was only partially successful. It is this which motivated me to interview a student who has gone through this phase and emerged sucessfully by getting a Phd admit from UIUC. Its my pleasure to have my own junior from NIT Trichy, Abhishek Verma on Coffee With Sundar!. Abhishek is the CS branch topper of 2008 batch. He is here to share his experiences on preparing for GRE and apping process. I hope this is helpful for you (if it is relevant.)

Me: Sundar Rajan G S

AV: Abhishek Verma

Me: Hi Abhishek, Welcome to Coffee With Sundar! Congrats on your phD admit at UIUC :-). How did you feel when you checked your result?

AV: I was elated when I checked my first result which was from Purdue university. This implied that I was definitely going to do a PhD. Then, I got a couple of rejects and finally I am on Cloud nine after the UIUC admit.

Me: What is your background? Whats your CGPA? Have you done internships before? What were your credentials? Can you share it with CWS Readers!

AV: My father is an Electrical Engineer in Maharashtra State Electricity Board and my mother is a housewife. I did my schooling in Sacred Heart Convent School in Ahmednagar. Maharashtra. I liked both Maths and Biology and couldn’t decide till I had the results of all the competitive exams after twelfth. I got the choice of Armed Forces Medical College or NIT Trichy. I finally decided to pursue Computer Science and Engineering. I fared well in acads in NITT. My CGPA currently is 9.57 (with the final semester still to go) and I am the department topper. I also topped all the departments in first year. I got Summer Undergraduate Research Grant for Excellence (SURGE) from IIT Kanpur after my Fourth Semester. Then I got an internship in Google Bangalore at the end of my sixth semester and worked as a part of the Orkut Team. Strong academics and good research projects certainly strengthened the application.

Me: Where all did you app? Have got admits else where? Are you waiting for any other better universities?

AV: I had applied to seven universities. Out of them, I got rejects from Stanford University and Carnegie Mellon University. I have received admits from University of Illinois at Urbana Champaign, Purdue University and University of Southern California (all with aid). I am still waiting to hear from California Institute of Technology and Georgia Institute of Technology. But UIUC is the best!

Me: Lets look at how the journey began. When did you start studying for GRE? What was your score? Did you join tution centre? How did you mug the words? Any suggestions to ppl who want to start? What advice would you give and what mistakes can be avoided?

AV: I had booked my GRE dates in the vacation after the sixth semester, but because of my Google internship, I had to postpone it to September. While booking dates, make sure that you have atleast an entire month free before that date. Cycle tests and developing random crushes are not a good thing for GRE prep, as I learned from personal experience. I had started looking at Barron’s word lists in my sixth semester. I devoted a complete month before the GRE exam for mugging up the word lists. I used flash cards, asked my friends to ask random words and diligently practiced all the tests in the Barron’s CD. I also practiced from Kaplan and the Big book. I did not join any tuition centre. I scored 600/800 in Verbal, 800/800 in Quants and 4/6 in Analytical Writing.

Quants: It is very easy to mess it up. It involves only basic high school maths. Make sure you know what Mean, median and mode are. Practice 2-3 tests and when you are confident of scoring 780-800, concentrate on verbal.

Verbal: Signup for feeds like Word for the day, etc. If a passage comes in the first 10 questions, DONT rush through it. Try to answer the first 10 questions correctly, as they matter most.

Analytical Writing: Read through a few sample essays and arguments.

AGRE: For people, who are interested in apping for PhD, Subjective GRE is highly recommended. I scored 820 (84 percentile). Be careful while marking choices, even after you have eliminated 2 or 3 options (out of 5). I attempted 70/70 questions and got only 52 of them correct (thus getting 48/70). I learnt it the hard way that, all choices you think are not equally likey. A 95+ percentile at (54/70) in AGRE would certainly have made rejecting my application (by Stan and CMU) more difficult.

TOEFL: Practice speaking and listening sections carefully. The rest should be a cake walk. But I still managed to mess it up, by getting the test date wrong. I had to register a second time, and my scores were Speaking - 27, Listening - 29, Reading - 30, Writing - 30 (All out of 30). Many universities exempt students having Speaking section score > 24/30 for English eligibility tests for TAship.

Me: This was indeed very helpful. I am sure starters will take note of it! Thanks a lot.

Me: Then comes university selections right? How did you select the list of universities? Did you take help from any counsellors or seniors? Can you share their contacts for readers, in case they are doing this? Any forums or resources which were useful?

AV: This was the toughest part. For deciding which universities to apply, find out seniors who have a similar profile as yours and see where all they had applied. Unfortunately, very few seniors from CS dept in NITT have applied for MS or PhD programs. My mentor in Google, Kiran Panesar helped me a lot in this regard. I wasn’t sure if I should apply directly after BTech or work in Google for a year and then apply. Kiran told that it was always better to have a continuity in formal education (He himself is a PhD from Gatech). He gave me a good recommendation letter. I looked at the US News & World Report raknigs and chose a mix of 2 safe bets - USC and Purdue; 3 moderate ones - Caltech, Gatech and UIUC and 2 ambitious ones - Stan and CMU. (I can justify them being safe, moderate or ambitious now, only after getting their decisions ). Forums like Edulix and Testmagic were very useful. Also this talk by a CMU prof was very useful.

I think recommendations are important in the application. I got strong recos from Hemalatha Thiagarajan (HT) maam, Google mentor Kiran Panesar and CS Dept HOD, Prof N Ramasubramnian. I was not in touch with the IITK prof under whom I did my SURGE project, and he refused to give a reco when I asked him. So always be in touch with your profs. Try to get recos from profs under whom you have worked (IIT or IISc brand name matters).

Me: What about specialization? When and how did you decide your subject of interest?

AV: I worked on Parallel Genetic Algorithms in SURGE, and then created a Beowulf cluster in NITT. I attended an international conference on high performance computing. Also I got an opportunity to use technologies like MapReduce during my Google internship. Distributed Computing gradually emerged as my area of interest.

Me: What about SOP? How important is it? How did you write it? Did you take help from any online resource? Can you share your SOP and/or any other reference sops? (Please attach. It will be very helpful. I am sure you would have used some reference.)

SOP is a very important part of the application. It is the substitute of an interview for the Admissions committee. I took help from a senior Sagar Thakar, (currently in IIMB). Also, I made a lot of my friends read it, and give suggestions. Here is my SOP. I went through some SOPs like this and this.

Me: Now that you have got an admit, what are you doing towards your PhD course? Are you doing any other study or project?

AV: I have chosen two electives : Distributed Computing and Data Mining which are closely related to my area of interest. My final year project is based on an exciting topic I have come across: Market forecasting using Genetic Neuro-Fuzzy algorithms.

Me: Thank you Abhishek. I wish you all the very best.

AV: Thanks for the honour.

Me: My pleasure.

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